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More thoughts generated by Tony

July 15, 2007

Here’s the latest exchange.  Enjoy.  I did.

Tony said: 

And Tony – that’s what you mean – a woman has her place, and obviously, it isn’t in talking with God, or being able to be the medium through which God and the Holy Spirit work.

I’d appreciate it if you wouldn’t put words in my mouth, because that is not what I mean. As a married man I am also invalid matter for the sacrament of Holy Orders.

I understand that this gender thing is your hobby horse, but it’s tedious when everything viewed through that distorted prism.


  • edit this on 15 Jul 2007 at 5:21 pm17 episcopalifem

    Now it’s my turn to lol @ you. I don’t think clergy should be required to be celibate either – although I think there are some people who feel called to be celibate. So I also reject your invalidation to/for ordination as a married person. But that’s neither here nor there.

    #1) YOU came here and asked the question in response to my idle prattle. I answered. I didn’t invite you, and right at the top of this blog it is says I’m ex-RC and a feminist. WTF did you think I would say? So either you like to have pointless arguments because you have no life or you are stupid. From what I can see of your responses, the latter option doesn’t seem to be the case. What’s a girl left to think?

    #2) You keep coming back and responding, despite being *yawn* bored by the answers. I keep coming back because I love to hear myself talk. This is my blog after all.

    #3) I have a graduate degree in counseling. I understand that unless a person has a very strong reason to do so, religious and political thought tends to remain very stable- it’s too close to core values – the very things that make us what and who we are, the things that speak most deeply to what we are all about. I’m not looking to convert you, or anyone else. This is why I left the RCC. I decided to speak with my feet, because that boys club isn’t going to change, and I don’t want to raise my family in such a close-minded place. I did so as prayerfully as you chose to remain RC. I think the RCC is a great place for you, and those whose spiritual needs are like yours. Be there strongly with God. I believe in my heart of hearts that the Creator is ready to meet us each where we are.

    God’s purpose is not human’s, and we are not capable of fully grasping the whole picture. Who can really say how God defines “unified” especially when the world the Creator mades us stewards over is so diverse. We can each only be responsible for the piece that is ours. It isn’t my job to convince you that I’m right and you are wrong. It satisfies me that you are a Christian, and struggling to live a good Christian life. The details of how you go about achieving that end are between you and Sophia.

    I’m personally more worried about the numbers of fine human beings who run screaming from Christianity in general, and who feel that agnosticism or atheism are their only real choices if they are to remain sane. Lots of wrong has been done in the name of religion (and not just Christianity) – that is the problem with tribalism. If somebody’s god is the only real God, then lots of people are going to be put out. The only way to peace is to find a way to respect our differences, embrace our similarities and get over the superiority complex humans suffer under as a species. Again, I know that you feel that those who run screaming are not worthy – are defective in some way, or irresponsible in some way – not willing to live with their sins or whatever. I just don’t believe that. God’s grace is his own to give as God sees fit. The only requirement is that we re-turn to God (turn back toward God). Remember how mad the prodigal son’s brother was that his dad threw him such a big party, after he had squandered his money, and made a mess of his life. The brother had always remained, had always done what the father expected, and what reward did he get? Neo-cons remind me of the brother, in many ways.

    Listen – we are coming from two totally different places I have no false expectation we’ll ever likely meet. Notice I didn’t stay to argue with you at your blog. I read two or three sentences and learned all I needed to know. You aren’t interested in dialogue – just neo-con ranting.

    If you don’t like what you read here, don’t let the door hit you in the ass on the way out. And if you feel the need to keep hitting your head on a hard thing, over and over, because it’s fun – well, you can get treatment for that, but not from me. It’s outside my expertise. I’ll pray for us both.

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    4 Comments leave one →
    1. July 16, 2007 4:18 am

      A woman with a degree!
      Whatever next?

    2. episcopalifem permalink*
      July 16, 2007 5:22 am

      I’m in UR internet tubes….fuxin’ with UR Puter.


    3. July 17, 2007 9:29 am

      Don’t you just love folks who define themselves by who they are not as opposed to who they are? I wonder sometimes if those folks even _know_ who they are.

      I come from a religious tradition that also is very closed. I did try the running screaming away from Christianity–but as I am a believer in the core of my being (exactly what you said above), that didn’t work. I had to find a new way of being Christian, of living my life out in a different faith community. Thank God for the inclusiveness of the Episcopal Church. I live a much more intentional life in Christ here than in my previous tradition, where I was more interested in dodging thunderbolts.

      As for pronouncing a position “tedious” when one is uninvited and has no “given” for even having a discussion, it is like the person who drops by the house without calling first then gripes due to his or her favorite snack being unavailable. Oy vey.

    4. episcopalifem permalink*
      July 17, 2007 10:08 pm

      Welcome Episcogranny! I got distracted with my own miasma, and didn’t get a chance to say thanks for stopping in, and I like the way you think. We can stick together over here where it’s safe, and inclusive!

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